Tuesday, June 24, 2008

Ice Ages caused by pole shifts

There is a much easier explanation for Ice Age extinctions and climate changes.
And the reports of a worldwide giant flood and catastrophic sea level rise.
There could be instead of polar caps growing and receeding,a pole shift, a shift of physical axis of the planet.
12000 years ago, we know that north america (mainly east US) and Europe were buried in ice. But there we humans in India, africa and south america. Mammoths were flash frozen in Siberia that had a lush and warm climate, and what could this mean?
Imagine that the equator line instead of running from central america, africa, india and indonesia would be like south america, africa, following to siberia and alaska.
And in fact, we also have the flash frozen evidence of animals in Alaska, a cold polar territory today. Large wolf animals have disappared there without leaving any modern descendants!
http://www.usd.edu/esci/alaska/research.html and http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/06/070621123444.htm
Again as said southern South America was where the equator passed, hence a different climate instead of the dry cold patagonia: http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=ice-age-south-america-was
Possibly the northern Greenlands was also warmer (the north pole would be somewhere in mid north atlantic east of america), and an areas between south africa and australia, would be the south pole. Antarctida could be warmer and green, particularly its peninsula. Australia also had partial extinction, possibly to a shift in climate, but not so dramatic (humans remained there as well).

8 comments:

Maju said...

It's not like that: only Northern Europe was under the ice sheet, and permafrost reached as far south as Szeged (southern Hungary) in Europe. So only about half of the continent was in such inhospitable conditions (and it was more like 14,000 years ago, at the Last Glacial Maximum, though there were some sudden spikes).

In Europe, even in the coldest periods, people were living specially in the Franco-Cantabrian region (southern France and Northern Spain), but also in southern Iberia (including some parts of Portugal), Italy and Ukraine and the Don basin in Russia (plus surely some areas of the Balcans too). In the less cold periods of the Ice Age, people lived as far north as the Netherlands, Saxony or southern England.

In North America too, only Canada and parts of the northern USA were frozen. In Asia it's even more striking because there was almost no ice sheet (apparently too dry, even if very cold too) though the permafrost reachd as far south as Beijing in he LGM.

And it was not apparently caused by any pole shifts. The reasons are not perfectly understood but seem to relate to alterations of oceanic circulation primarily. In other words: there was no Gulf stream to warm Northern Europe (though admittedly this is a regionally simplified explanation).

Now, in Astrological terms, Sedna was also near Earth (or near the Sun if you wish) when the Ice Age came to an end. And now with its new visit we seem to face even further global warming.

segurelha said...

Yes. I thank you for your input.
However, I tend to be suspicious of geological and archeological data. Humans could have been there and there but the climate different.
Initially I truly believed in the procession and in ice ages. Now I am asking what really happens.
Accounting to ancient civilizations that is widespread tales of destruction, and giant floods. This was present in mesopotanian, american, aboriginal, sumerian, indian and many other myths!
These dates, around 3000BC, 6000BC and 9500BC, besides others could have marked something caused both civilizations to collapse, climatic changes and tidal waves around the world and also volcanoes. Who knows if it was a solar storm, some cosmic event, just a geological change, a meteor strike or else.
I am open to all scenarios but having a critical way. Furthemore what really intriguees me is that the predictions for a few years ahead also correlate with some major cycles of drastic change, such as destruction, climatic change and solar activity.
I am seeking the answers like you! Anything you discover just tell me!

Maju said...

All I can say that there are also many mythologies reporting no floods at all. Have you ever heard of any flood myth among Greeks? They lived not far from the sea, yet no massive flood is remembered.

Basques also have no flood legends. Other peoples have drought legends instead. The Chinese version of the "the flood" is about how to control it (digging waterways, canals), not about any massive destruction that killed humankind. Even Egyptians had AFAIK no record of any flood: even if they lived in a large river basin the Nile floods were always regular.

Flood legends seem to be associated to peoples who lived at large river basins prone to such catstrophes, or their area of cultural influence (Suemrians clearly influenced Hebrews, for example). Archaeology has found signs of many localized floods in Mesopotamia and elsewhere but nothing like a catastrophic masive flood. The Black Sea flood hypothesis is still not mainstream, in fact many question it. Some scholars think that the term, in the Sumerian case, is a metaphore of the massive arrival of Semitic peoples (a human flood rather than a physical one) and the destruction of the mythical (yet archaologically attested: El Ubayd culture) "antediluvian" age, when Sumerians were the sole leaders of the known world.

segurelha said...

Thanks for the input. In fact that is also another possibility, although the magnitude and detail of many ancient manuscripts would seem strange from that perspective. I still think that some geological or climatic change inspire those readings. At least, the scientific evidence for some meteor strikes and sudden ice sheet collapses may be true. It is also very striking that ice ages come and go in regular periods and that weather also varies accordingly in similar periods and also smaller periods such as a theorized 1500 year period, linking it to the little ice age.

By the way, what are your perspective about the precession of echinoxs, what causes them, and their astrological influence upon mankind?
What do you think it may happen around 2012? And even before with the cardinal T-square between Uranus/Jupiter, Pluto and Saturn/Mars (I assume you are into astrology as well)

Your first insight about Sedna was also interesting. You might have read my assay about the possible influence of these several new "planets". What is your perspective on their influence in our charts and mundane issues?
Do you believe future weather is going to become cooler, warmer or something else will happen?

Good to hear from you. Best,

Maju said...

By the way, what are your perspective about the precession of echinoxs, what causes them, and their astrological influence upon mankind?

That's something I had missed. You must mean the Milankovich cycles, right? You may be right about that affecting climate, though they don't seem the only force in action. Thanks for the tip.

As for precession in Astrology. All I know is that Western Astrology (unlike Indian one) has ignored the phenomenon and instead uses a local Zodiac based on seasons (i.e. the dance of the Earth and the Sun), that I find that works pretty well. Considering that I suspect that Solar magnetism is the main physical force behind Astrology, I'd rather ignore mostly the outer universe and certainly constellations that are nothing but imaginary drawings in the night sky, whose shape and very existence has changed as the Sun and the stars that form them revolve around the Galactic Center.

So I don't believe in the Age of Aquarius, I am a dissident anti-Aquarean. Instead I think that the position of the Galactic Center (right now in late Saggitarius) may mark real astrological ages. I don't write much on astrology in my blog as of late but on this issue I did write something: http://leherensuge.blogspot.com/2008/02/galactic-center-marks-astrological-eras.html

What do you think it may happen around 2012? And even before with the cardinal T-square between Uranus/Jupiter, Pluto and Saturn/Mars (I assume you are into astrology as well)

Yes, I am. I used even to have a forum: http://s10.invisionfree.com/AstroPunk_Community. It is still there physically (you can read the topics) but I decided to close it some months ago for lack of participation.

I am more concerned about the repeated Jupiter+Uranus stellium at 0º Aries in 2010-11. I believe it will mark radical changes, not sure exactly what. Some elements resemble pre-WWII (if I don't recall badly), so I am concerned. But on the other hand I think this World needs a good shake up so I look forward to that moment with optimism. As a person who has most planets in the Cancer-Virgo arch, I am also tired of the slow transits through Capricorn, Aquarius and Pisces, that oppose me quite annoyingly.

I would need to review the transits for this period but I have certainly been aware of a period of change (renaissance?) beginning at 2010 and also of the current economic crisis caused by Pluto's transit though Capricorn, that looks is still going to be there by the beginning of the next decade.

Your first insight about Sedna was also interesting. You might have read my assay about the possible influence of these several new "planets".

Sure. Can you give me a link?

What is your perspective on their influence in our charts and mundane issues?

I have still doubts on Sedna and the smaller objects of the KB, like Quaoar, Ixion, etc. But I welcomed the IAU decission re. Pluto, Eris and Ceres because that fills up my rulership system perfectly. Ceres rules Virgo, Pluto Scorpio (of course) and Eris Libra. I suspect there may be other planets (rather than just dwarf planets out there, beyond the KB), so maybe this assignment, even if essentially correct IMO, sould be provisional too.

I think Sedna is a messenger of that something beyond the KB. And I hope it's cleared up soon - though maybe not. I look at this new frontier of knowledge anyhow with outmost interest.

Do you believe future weather is going to become cooler, warmer or something else will happen?

By the moment everything points to warming. This is not astrology but climate science. The visit of Sedna only seems to confirm that.

Enjoy.

segurelha said...

Hallo, thanks for your pretty insights :)
Take these links where I wrote about Sedna (I was first analysing what these "planets" could have done in my chart and transits) Then I read all I could find in the internet.
http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=2557643118767798271&postID=9004271146607434112
In the second link I point to Sedna being in Aries (which may cause the predicted global warming you said!
http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=2557643118767798271&postID=1342970855417526761
check also this link in which I wrote a post that could assume (besides the manmade global warming) that naturaly rather cold weather will come after 2020, due to the position of outer planets in watery and earthy Of course no ones for sure what may come, but judging from a possible gulf stream slowing due to pole ice melting and predicted low solar activity: signs.http://astrotransits.blogspot.com/2008/06/weather-for-2008-influences-of-planet.html
The following is just my personal speculation
http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=2557643118767798271&postID=8146747577090045065
And the following was my first analysis in the astrology of the new "planets" and other asteroids and centaurs (also based in personal observation and in other websites information):
http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=2557643118767798271&postID=6254003551161205819

You have also some information about sideral astrology (well, I discover a hint by practical observation that at least now, as of 20/21st century, tropical astrology works better than sideral, but even though, days seem a bit shifted, as for example aries influence tends to be markly in late april and gemini influence by late june). Anyway, check the dates at which I have arrived, which curiously are very close to many other ancient culture's astrology and calendars:
Browse the blog until you find the posts about tropical versus sideral astrology
http://www.astrotransits.blogspot.com/


Finally all over my latest posts in my blog http://www.astrotransits.blogspot.com/
You may find information about possible events surronding the 2012configuration. I think at least economic crisis is due to occur (I have seen that a year ago ;) ), war and earth changes are also possible and those would bring the worseof the crisis and also mass migrations is another thing very possible due to the radical combination of uranus/jupiter in aries cusp. Anyway, the themes of some famine, a new sense of end and beggining (aries) and very gradual dramatic society trasformation is certain (pluto transiting capricorn and then the revolutionary aquarius by 2020). Have Hope!

I will have a look at your website.
Thanks for all the share and ideas!

segurelha said...

By the way I wrote a comment in your blog. It is a very possibility that during 2010-2020 the reforming and sometimes very dramatic tendencies of Pluto transiting Capricorn and then Aquarius will cause our world maps to change very significantly.
Former similar aspects in 1770s, 1850s, 1930s and 1960s caused this. Pluto going in Capricorn causes empires to crash and empires to rise. Look for big changes in middle east, africa, reformulation of the north america maps and europe. Actually when Pluto first stars in Capricorn it exagerates authoritatian tendencies (always a thing that happens when leaders fear the danger of change coming in). You see that happening in europe (striving for a false and imposed union) and in america. I wonder that by 2020 europe can be a different thing, spain may fragment and many countries demans their freedom, and others form unions. Anyway, I think many are tired of these old money-based politics and it is the time for people-based politics (uranus in aries would stir revolutions and rebel protests as did many times before), that would surely come in when pluto approaches aquarius.

Maju said...

It is a very possibility that during 2010-2020 the reforming and sometimes very dramatic tendencies of Pluto transiting Capricorn and then Aquarius will cause our world maps to change very significantly.

Sure. More than just our world maps. Last time this transit happened, it was the time of major revolutions (late 17th century). I don't expect less. Surely the transit through Capricorn preludes the major changes in Aquarius. First Pluto subverts the structures (Cap), including the economy, then the social and political institutions (Aqu).

As a member of AstroPunk forum used to say: Pluto rocks! Of course Plutonian changes are the kind of "you can't make an omelette without breaking some eggs", you know. It won't be an easy time for sure. It's not already and it has just begun.

Take these links where I wrote about Sedna...

Wow! Lots of stuff. I'll read them gradually on risk of getting a headache.

With my many (five) planets in Virgo and Saturn in first house, though, I tend to avoid getting overwhelmed by smaller objects. I normally work just with the luminaries, planets and dwarf planets (plus the GC, as you already know). I certainly ignore Chiron (just another asteroid) but also anything that is too small and not minimally round. It's an arbitrary limit, I know, but I think one has to get focused somewhat: more info is not necesarily better info.

Enjoy.